14712 Posts in 2613 Topics - by 7905 Members - Latest Member: LiamHagen

Author Topic: Collaborative Balancing  (Read 3179 times)

nonSENSE

  • September 2011
  • 1365 Posts
    • STEAM_0:0:11953676 STEAM_0:0:11953676
« March 26, 2014, 02:17:56 PM » #11286
As the gamemode grows, we'd love for you to give us your ideas on weapon / monster / loot balance.

We have opened a spreadsheet documenting some of the current weapons, mechanics and values. Anybody is free to comment on the document.

If you wish to participate in tweaking some values, you can request to be added as a contributor in this thread. Note: Contributors will need to provide us with a Google account that we can share the document with.


Keyes

  • February 2013
  • 102 Posts
    • STEAM_0:1:44681461 STEAM_0:1:44681461
« March 26, 2014, 05:13:17 PM » #11287
Hi, I'd contribute whenever I can.

A couple things I've noticed where with the weapon rates, How do you judge the semi auto fire rate? Because the FN-Five Seven seems to be kind of close to the MAC10s rate of fire, and MAC 10s fire quite fast.

/FIRE RATE/

AK-47 needs to be slower, its on the same as a MAC-10 although it has a lower damage point.

The UMP-45 I think should be slowed quite a bit, maybe to around the AK-47s speed.

Steyr AUG should be a bit slower (maybe by 0.01) and bring the MAC-10 up to where the UMP-45 was. 

P90 should be inbetween the AUG and the MAC-10.

TMP could be a bit faster (maybe up to 0.12)

Well thats what I have for now, I judged the speeds partly by just the mag sizes and a bit off what the real world fire rates are (I'm not sure if thats what you're looking for or not)

I'll take a look at the other topics soon.

Hope it helps.


« Last Edit: March 26, 2014, 05:15:26 PM by Keyes »
One does not simply, get 60 items per day (you know who you are)

nonSENSE

  • September 2011
  • 1365 Posts
    • STEAM_0:0:11953676 STEAM_0:0:11953676
« March 26, 2014, 05:30:02 PM » #11288
A couple things I've noticed where with the weapon rates, How do you judge the semi auto fire rate? Because the FN-Five Seven seems to be kind of close to the MAC10s rate of fire, and MAC 10s fire quite fast.

Let's define fire rate in this context; it is minimum delay between attacks on both automatic and manual weapons. By this definition, lower number in the fire rate column means faster attacks (a better name could be attack delay, but this is a simplified document).
This means that if you can click fast enough, your Five Seven can potentially fire almost as fast as the MAC10.

AK-47 needs to be slower, its on the same as a MAC-10 although it has a lower damage point.

The UMP-45 I think should be slowed quite a bit, maybe to around the AK-47s speed.

Steyr AUG should be a bit slower (maybe by 0.01) and bring the MAC-10 up to where the UMP-45 was. 

P90 should be inbetween the AUG and the MAC-10.

TMP could be a bit faster (maybe up to 0.12)

I have adjusted these a bit, however you need to also factor in other variables:

- Reload time: Very high on rifles (AK47 / AUG), which could be fatal in certain situations.
- Accuracy: The biggest factor of them all, and unfortunately the one that is hardest to represent in this document. A 100% accuracy rating obviously results in a 0 unit spread. Anything below 80% will start being extremely unpredictable. <60% = spray and pray.

The most accurate representation is thus the DPS / 10s (A) field, which calculates the damage dealt over 10 second including reload time, as well as an approximated "hit and miss" calculation.

I judged the speeds partly by just the mag sizes and a bit off what the real world fire rates are (I'm not sure if thats what you're looking for or not)

I should have mentioned this in the OP: The goal of this document is to balance the weapons so they all have a purpose in the game (ie: "Zombies are far away, I have plenty of time to reload, i'll grab rifle X with reload time of 4 seconds"). While it would be a bonus to have the weapons act as realistically as possible, i don't think this should be a requirement but rather a guideline.

« Last Edit: March 26, 2014, 05:32:46 PM by nonSENSE »

Keyes

  • February 2013
  • 102 Posts
    • STEAM_0:1:44681461 STEAM_0:1:44681461
« March 26, 2014, 05:36:18 PM » #11290
A couple things I've noticed where with the weapon rates, How do you judge the semi auto fire rate? Because the FN-Five Seven seems to be kind of close to the MAC10s rate of fire, and MAC 10s fire quite fast.

Let's define fire rate in this context; it is minimum delay between attacks on both automatic and manual weapons. By this definition, lower number in the fire rate column means faster attacks (a better name could be attack delay, but this is a simplified document).
This means that if you can click fast enough, your Five Seven can potentially fire almost as fast as the MAC10.

AK-47 needs to be slower, its on the same as a MAC-10 although it has a lower damage point.

The UMP-45 I think should be slowed quite a bit, maybe to around the AK-47s speed.

Steyr AUG should be a bit slower (maybe by 0.01) and bring the MAC-10 up to where the UMP-45 was. 

P90 should be inbetween the AUG and the MAC-10.

TMP could be a bit faster (maybe up to 0.12)

I have adjusted these a bit, however you need to also factor in other variables:

- Reload time: Very high on rifles (AK47 / AUG), which could be fatal in certain situations.
- Accuracy: The biggest factor of them all, and unfortunately the one that is hardest to represent in this document. A 100% accuracy rating obviously results in a 0 unit spread. Anything below 80% will start being extremely unpredictable. <60% = spray and pray.

The most accurate representation is thus the DPS / 10s (A) field, which calculates the damage dealt over 10 second including reload time, as well as an approximated "hit and miss" calculation.

I judged the speeds partly by just the mag sizes and a bit off what the real world fire rates are (I'm not sure if thats what you're looking for or not)

I should have mentioned this in the OP: The goal of this document is to balance the weapons so they all have a purpose in the game (ie: "Zombies are far away, I have plenty of time to reload, i'll grab rifle X with reload time of 4 seconds"). While it would be a bonus to have the weapons act as realistically as possible, i don't think this should be a requirement but rather a guideline.

Well it just one thing that stood out to me at time, but I will take a good look at it now. How am I "added" to the contributor list? I would be more than glad to help.
One does not simply, get 60 items per day (you know who you are)

nonSENSE

  • September 2011
  • 1365 Posts
    • STEAM_0:0:11953676 STEAM_0:0:11953676
« March 26, 2014, 05:41:48 PM » #11291
How am I "added" to the contributor list? I would be more than glad to help.

Send me PM containing a Google account I can share the document with.

Keyes

  • February 2013
  • 102 Posts
    • STEAM_0:1:44681461 STEAM_0:1:44681461
« March 26, 2014, 05:54:42 PM » #11292
How am I "added" to the contributor list? I would be more than glad to help.

Send me PM containing a Google account I can share the document with.
Would that be the Google + or email address?
One does not simply, get 60 items per day (you know who you are)

nonSENSE

  • September 2011
  • 1365 Posts
    • STEAM_0:0:11953676 STEAM_0:0:11953676
« March 26, 2014, 05:56:20 PM » #11293
email

Keyes

  • February 2013
  • 102 Posts
    • STEAM_0:1:44681461 STEAM_0:1:44681461
« March 28, 2014, 08:17:30 PM » #11303
Suggestions for Sanctuary Weapons

AUG: I thought the AUG should represent a more single fire like Rifle,
apposed to the AK-47, which would a more auto rifle. of course there are
multiple auto weapons, but I feel the AK-47 and AUG would both as good
contrast weapons;One Slower, More Accurate Rifle with a smaller magazine,
and the other being a Full Auto, Less accurate but with a larger magazine.

By Comparing the UMP-45 to the AUG, I think the AUG Should be as slow as
The UMP, and have the UMP be at 0.15-0.16 fire delay. I think the Ammo
should be smaller, reduced to maybe 20-25. The Damage could maybe be increased,
But then again with a high Accuracy, it could be probably stay the same.

Suggestion:

ClipSize : 25
FireRate : 0.2

AK47: Edited: I think the Ak47 needs a higher mag, as compared to the AUG, it is much less accurate.

Suggestion:

MinDmg : 19
MaxDmg : 37
AvgDmg : 28
ClipSize : 30

TMP: No suggestion/Seems Balanced

P90: I guess the Numbullets Being 2 means it is two per shot to give the
impression of it being a very fast full auto weapon, but with a weaker shot
I think it should have 5 extra bullets, as it is the weakest full primary.

Suggestion:
ClipSize: 50


I will expand on this, but I am just trying to work out some of the
weapon factors.

For Example, My Version of the AK47:

30 Bullets
19 MinD
28 AvgD
37 MaxD

Dmg Per Clip = 840

Dmg Per Sec = 186

Dmg Per 10 Sec = 1153 (I may have calculated this wrong, I did 10-3.8 (I am taking that the reload is in 3.8 seconds)  to get 6.2, then multiply it buy the average damage per sec. )

« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 08:48:26 PM by Keyes »
One does not simply, get 60 items per day (you know who you are)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.